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The Failure of Atheism to Account for Existence - Page 3 - Redneck Clubhouse - Of, By and For Rednecks!

Sunday Gota Meetin' Religion and the discussion of right and wrong

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  #21  
Old July 10th, 2013, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by TNHarley View Post
Maybe containing the word of God would be more appropriate?
far more apt description then I was making
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  #22  
Old July 10th, 2013, 11:04 AM
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there are only two possibilities to account for the cause of the universe
Only if you're vain and self important enough to think humans are sufficiently advanced to be able to narrow it down to only two. We don't, and can't possibly, know that.

The whole argument is fallacious and circular, starts with a false premise then props it up with more false premises. It's about as scientific as any other "proven by science" garbage crap you see them hawk on TV.

It's pure hucksterism. Hokum.
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Old July 10th, 2013, 12:58 PM
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Religion is not truth, Rawlings
I agree. Jesus Christ, the incarnate God Almighty, is the truth:
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me (John 14:6).
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Old July 10th, 2013, 01:11 PM
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The word of God isn't truth either
By definition the world of God would necessarily be the truth. What you meant to say here, apparently, is that the Bible is not the word of God or is not the truth.

Brain fart. No big deal, at 55, I do it all the time now.
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  #25  
Old July 10th, 2013, 01:18 PM
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Right after you prove your negative........ It says it is the word of God whether it is the whole book or parts is up to what YOU wish to believe. It doesn't say definitively one way or the other.
It's not possible for it to be the whole book because it didn't exist as a whole at the time of the writing of the component parts. Therefore it could not refer to itself as "the word of God" in its entirety.
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Old July 10th, 2013, 01:25 PM
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By definition the world of God would necessarily be the truth. What you meant to say here, apparently, is that the Bible is not the word of God or is not the truth.

Brain fart. No big deal, at 55, I do it all the time now.
Do you believe the entire Bible to literally be the "word of God"? Or do you at least leave some room for human influence?
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Old July 10th, 2013, 04:22 PM
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Do you believe the entire Bible to literally be the "word of God"? Or do you at least leave some room for human influence?
I believe that the entire Bible is the word of God, but the matter is more complex than that simple expression would suggest. I don't really want to get into the technicalities of textual criticism though. It's sort off topic and gets complex. Personally, I'm well satisfied that the bulk of the received texts are reliable, and the questionable portions of some translations are known and quite irrelevant. But ultimately the moment of personal encounter and revelation is spiritual.
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  #28  
Old July 10th, 2013, 04:23 PM
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Only if you're vain and self important enough to think humans are sufficiently advanced to be able to narrow it down to only two. We don't, and can't possibly, know that.

The whole argument is fallacious and circular, starts with a false premise then props it up with more false premises. It's about as scientific as any other "proven by science" garbage crap you see them hawk on TV.

It's pure hucksterism. Hokum.
You keep mentioning science as if philosophy asserts that the rational forms and logical categories of human consciousness, including the classical laws of logic and the ontological imperatives of origin, are scientific in nature. It does no such thing. They are rational constructs. And certainly neither I nor the author of the apology in the above claims otherwise. How many times, now, have I told you that? Indeed, how many times do you have to be told the obvious.

Hence, your criticism is false, and it's also misleading, as it wrongfully suggests that science, methodology and evaluation, rests on something material, which is absurd, rather than something rational, namely, one metaphysical presupposition or another.

Further, the observation that there is but two known expressions or states of existence—the animate and the inanimate, with the former comprised of the sentient and non-sentient—is a scientific fact. And that will remain a scientific fact until something else, something inconceivable, something unimaginable, is discovered.


It's your numerous strawmen in the above that are pure hucksterism or hokum.


As for the ontological imperatives of origin. . . .

We begin with the fact that we cannot explain how something could arise from nothing.
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Last edited by Rawlings; July 10th, 2013 at 04:30 PM.
  #29  
Old July 10th, 2013, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Rawlings View Post
You keep mentioning science as if philosophy asserts that the rational forms and logical categories of human consciousness, including the classical laws of logic and the ontological imperatives of origin, are scientific in nature. It does no such thing. They are rational constructs. And certainly neither I nor the author of the apology in the above claims otherwise. How many times, now, have I told you that? Indeed, how many times do you have to be told the obvious.

Hence, your criticism is false, and it's also misleading, as it wrongfully suggests that science, methodology and evaluation, rests on something material, which is absurd, rather than something rational, namely, one metaphysical presupposition or another.

Further, the observation that there is but two known expressions or states of existence—the animate and the inanimate, with the former comprised of the sentient and non-sentient—is a scientific fact. And that will remain a scientific fact until something else, something inconceivable, something unimaginable, is discovered.


It's your numerous strawmen in the above that are pure hucksterism or hokum.


As for the ontological imperatives of origin. . . .

We begin with the fact that we cannot explain how something could arise from nothing.
I see you have avoided my post so I will take that as a concession.

If you claim everything arises from God, what THING is God?
  #30  
Old July 10th, 2013, 05:03 PM
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There is no entropy problem.
Try again.
I don't necessarily endorse everything in Slik's apology, you understand. It's serves as a jumping off point.

For the sake of clarity, though, and enlightenment for all, perhaps you'll care to elaborate.
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