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Old November 19th, 2016, 04:54 AM
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Default Easily the most fascinating recent experimental physics result

Final NASA Eagleworks Paper Confirms Promising EmDrive Results, Proposes Theoretical Model | Hacked

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Earlier this month Hacked reported that a draft version of the much expected EmDrive paper by the NASA Eagleworks team, had been leaked. Now, the final version of the paper has been published.

The NASA Eagleworks paper, titled “Measurement of Impulsive Thrust from a Closed Radio-Frequency Cavity in Vacuum,” has been published online as an open access “article in advance” in the American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics (AIAA)’s Journal of Propulsion and Power, a prestigious peer-reviewed journal. The paper will appear in the December print issue of the journal.

The final version of the paper is very similar to the leaked draft. In particular, the NASA scientists confirm the promising experimental results:

“Thrust data from forward, reverse, and null suggested that the system was consistently performing at 1.2 ± 0.1 mN∕kW, which was very close to the average impulsive performance measured in air. A number of error sources were considered and discussed.”
If they're not smoking weed this is YUUUGE.
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Old November 19th, 2016, 10:38 AM
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Saw it. It supposedly works but they still can explain why. Sometimes practical results outpace theory. I hope someone has the sense to purse this thoroughly.
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Old November 19th, 2016, 11:35 AM
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Cool. Next stop - Mars.
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Old November 19th, 2016, 01:38 PM
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I've downloaded the paper proper and will have a read tomorrow morning. Sadly, years of disuse have turned my brains to mush, but I figure I can still grok this better than your average suburbanite slob. Will be exciting.
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Old November 19th, 2016, 03:25 PM
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I think the biggest problem is that current theory simple cannot show has this should even work. Apparently in limited tests it does but no one can offer a rational theory as to how it does. I think the main problem is that it contradicts conservation of mass theory or something similar.
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Gentlemen, he said I don't need your organization, I've shined your shoes
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But Eden is burning either brace yourself for elimination
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Old November 19th, 2016, 05:14 PM
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Roddenberry's "Impulse Engines" comes to reality.
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Old November 20th, 2016, 02:48 PM
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Oh-kay.

So I read the paper. Before I comment, some caveats:
*) I haven't been doing this shit for years, and the more cognitive effort a task requires, the faster your sharp skill deteriorates with the lack of practice.
*) Even so, finding time to get "in the zone" with wife and kids running around on a Sunday morning is a no-go.
*) It is somewhat outside my particular skillset even back when it was honed - I was all into crushing atoms for fun and profit, non of this weird pseudomachanic whatchacallit stuff.

(As a comparison, I could spot the "cold fusion" error more or less directly when they finally came around to publish a working paper on it. But that was spot in the middle of my competency and I was effectively a good double dozen or so IQ:s higher back then.)

All that said... I can't spot an error here. The experiment is properly controlled. The error sources are properly accounted for. Some thinking didn't lend itself to suggest additional error sources they should have corrected for. Their attempt at theoretical explanation looks painfully post hoc to me, but again, not my table, really.

Now, unless they find some unaccounted for bleed-off somewhere (say, like we eventually found to explain Cherenkov radiation) the most immediate concern for theoretical physicists would be that conservation of momentum, a "fundamental law of nature" so well established that possibly nobody would want to mess with it, is out the door. In which case, this engine is kinda like the unexplainable sharp emission and absorption spectras in light that so befuddled classical physicists at the beginning of the last century and eventually led to QM. My money, that said, is still on either some oversight with the experimantal setup or some sort of as-yet-unaccounted for bleed-off of momentum.
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Old November 20th, 2016, 04:06 PM
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I'm hoping for an new understanding of physics, that would be so cool. But won't the liberals say that the "Science is settled"?
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“I think it’s unfair. We voted for Hillary Clinton, but it is Trump who won. It is unfair,” Heloïse said.
Gentlemen, he said I don't need your organization, I've shined your shoes
I've moved your mountains and marked your cards
But Eden is burning either brace yourself for elimination
Or else your hearts must have the courage for the changing of the guards.
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Old November 20th, 2016, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by walruskkkch View Post
I'm hoping for an new understanding of physics, that would be so cool. But won't the liberals say that the "Science is settled"?
We really don't actually know shit about it. We think we do, but we don't. We've yet to barely scratch the surface in pretty much all sciences.
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Old November 20th, 2016, 09:11 PM
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Except climate science, duh.
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“I think it’s unfair. We voted for Hillary Clinton, but it is Trump who won. It is unfair,” Heloïse said.
Gentlemen, he said I don't need your organization, I've shined your shoes
I've moved your mountains and marked your cards
But Eden is burning either brace yourself for elimination
Or else your hearts must have the courage for the changing of the guards.
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